Who Is The Fittest Person On Earth? | EP 97

[00:00] In the beginning, episode 97. Courtney Atkinson, how are you? I'm good mate, we've got a huge day today. There's so much in here. What? It's sports everywhere at the moment. There is so much going on. We've got the Commonwealth Games to talk about, we've got a heap of running and sport news we want to jump into as well. And what I will say, Courtney, is before the end I have an announcement. You've— No, no, no, this time I've cleared it, I've teased it. I'm all good to go, I'll do it at the end of the episode, but I've got

[00:31] a running-related announcement. Yep, we'll get to that. OK, Sydney Marathon. Yep, that is the next marathon on. We should give a quick shout out this weekend — Sunny Coast Marathon runners, if you're running the Sunny Coast Marathon, thank you for giving us a kick up the backside. Luke wasn't happy that we were ignoring the Sunny Coast Marathon that's happening this weekend. Yeah, good luck to anybody tackling the Sunny Coast Marathon. There's a lot of people that missed out on Goldie, and

[01:03] settled for the Sunny Coast because they wanted to run a marathon here in Queensland. So they'll be tackling the Sunny Coast, but the next big one is the Sydney Marathon. I've got a little bit of audio — did you get that audio? Yeah, I did. It was from the Prosper podcast. This is a man describing the Sydney Marathon course: "The way I would describe this course, the Sydney Marathon course, is if the New York Marathon, the Boston Marathon,

[01:33] and the Tokyo Marathon got together and had a tryst and ended up having an illegitimate child — this course would be it." So you heard it here first. What are you — so I basically read that as this is a bloody tough course, like it's a tricky course, is the way I take that feedback on from this. I think that guy's Instagram profile — he runs all the majors or something. OK, so he knows the majors, because I listened to it and

[02:04] it actually means nothing to me because I don't know what the other ones are. Yeah, I think basically that's an interesting perspective on how the Sydney Marathon is being portrayed internationally. Yeah, right, for those people — because obviously we here know Sydney, the layout, the area, but internationally, for those people that might be based in America or Europe, that's the way it's being pitched, which is an interesting perspective. But the bit of news I wanted to talk to you about — what you and I bang on about is how these major marathons,

[02:35] these big city marathons, for the most part don't have to market to try and get entrants anymore. They don't have to spend their time — they're overselling, they're oversubscribed — now it's all about what can the race provide the competitors on top of just participating. What else can they provide? And I love this from Sydney Marathon: they have become the first marathon in the world to provide every participant with access to personalised AI-powered mindset

[03:07] coaching. More than 40,000 registered runners will receive free access to a programme called Marathon State of Mind, a sports psychology platform co-created by two-time Olympian Eloise Wellings — who ran here on the Gold Coast Marathon weekend — and performance psychology coach Dr Rory Dawkins. It's priced at more than $1,500 per participant: a six-week programme, personalised AI coaching, live sessions, race-day audio support and post-race check-ins,

[03:38] bringing sports psychology to every runner on the start line. Yeah, you like it? I — look, I haven't, I don't know what Marathon State of Mind is like. If you jump on their website it's all great, unsurprisingly it's nothing but positive reviews. But what I love is the race organisers finding a way to add value to their event beyond just a T-shirt and a finisher's medal. Yeah, my first

[04:09] inkling was — I think I agree, like anything, you're giving extra. Yeah, yeah, I mean you're getting extra for nothing, right? So that's a positive. I actually really like the idea of the psychology — like in the right way it can really help you. And I did actually jump in and read a few of the reviews, and that's the kind of thing I like — you know, when it gets tough, this is what I'm feeling. So talking through psychology in itself I think is beneficial. Where I'm going to go — oh OK, here we go.

[04:39] But where I'm going to take a step back is: do we actually need — like how much is enough? Like, yes, we're providing more and more value, but in today's world of technology, when is enough, enough? I was on Strava this morning, ran down here with the local guys at Gold Coast Run Co around Pizzi Park, jumped on Strava — the first thing it asked me is have you got a goal, plug it in. Next thing I know it's hitting me up: do you want to join Runna? Before I knew it, I was

[05:10] halfway down an AI training programme and I hadn't even had my coffee for the morning. So again, I love the idea of the psychology and I think there are benefits for it, so there is positive in this. What I'm just questioning is when's enough, enough? Interesting — when I went into the questions and answers here, because I read into it, Eloise has set this up herself with her programme and everything else, which is amazing. You get into the T&Cs,

[05:44] the questions down the bottom: is Elsie a real person? Elsie is an AI coach. Her voice was created with Eloise. Her coaching follows the method of Eloise and Rory that they built together. Let's be real, this is an AI bot. Wow. I'm happy to be challenged. It's not — Elsie is not a substitute for a medical or psychological care.

[06:14] Does that change your mind about this? This makes me stop and think — it's an AI, it really does now. I mean, of course it hasn't been trained on all those things — I'm not, I'm actually for this, don't get me wrong. I think psychology in running, in this space, and if that's the way we can give it to a wider group and scale it, that's fine. But let's just also be really clear — well, here's the thing, to get a better understanding of where it's

[06:46] coming from. To jump back — for those people that might have followed along on the Gold Coast Marathon series we've done previously with Benita Willis and Lace Up Running, that's you get personalised coaching. And what we always talked about when we compared what Benita offers with Lace Up Running versus anything you can get out of ChatGPT or AI apps — yep, it can provide you with a 12-week training block, but the difference is that does not know you as a person. It does not know what mood you've woken up in, it does not know what medical things you might have going on, it does not know what life you

[07:18] are leading. Transfer that to this and it's psychology again. Now, what's Doctor Rory's surname again? Dr Rory Dawkins. So I think — I mean both are professionals — I think where we can leave it is: let's just be really clear, Runna is an AI training app that works really well for a lot of people, yes, but it's not a personal coach. No. And this is, in the same way, I think a

[07:49] great idea to be able to scale psychology, but let's just be clear — it's not a sports psychologist either. But if anybody listening is running the Sydney Marathon and you've already been utilising Marathon State of Mind, love your feedback, would love to hear how you found it. And because obviously, again, if you jump on the website it's nothing but positive —

[08:21] I actually think the idea of going into a marathon having the psychology training, going through what you might face and understanding how it's going to feel, and taking you through that, I think it's really, really beneficial. So yeah, on that it's great value — again, it goes to that thing of if you're providing it free with my entry, I'll use it. Me, at my level of athleticism and running, I would never invest the money in a sports

[08:54] psychologist ahead of a race, but if I get a service free with my entry — You'll try it? I'll try it, yeah. Brilliant, so it's a great, great gift. Yeah, and again, that key bit though — Elsie's AI, but it's not Eloise Wellings, which is very interesting. I didn't pick that up. Hey, let's talk a bit of Commonwealth Games, yeah? Because we are in the thick of it. As soon as I started prepping for this and thinking about this — have you ever been to the Commonwealth Games? No. What?

[09:25] How? Yeah, it just didn't — we were trying to work out which Commonwealth Games were which. Manchester — I was in a bit of a selection scrap for Manchester, and I think it got down to, you know, I'd placed second in both selection races. Manchester was 2002. Yeah, I actually got second, I believe, in both selection races — maybe my memory is not great, but it was something like that — and I got overlooked for

[09:55] third place, really. Melbourne, I just wasn't good enough at the time. We didn't race in Delhi because of the water quality. Hold on, what happened in 2006? You were 26. Melbourne, I wasn't good enough. No, I wasn't good enough, really. I just wasn't performing at that time to make the team. And then, yeah, Delhi, we didn't have it. So anyway, let's get onto the Commonwealth Games right now, because in my head, I think of you and

[10:27] your career and I kind of go — well, Courtney was just the best during his career. Oh no, not always. But that's just the way my brain got it — thank you, Liam. No, no, but like, so when you say — and we've talked a bit about it with Andy Buchanan the other week, where in my head the elite athlete, I think Andy's progress is only linear, every race he runs is going to be faster, he's going to continue to do that — that he came here on the Gold Coast and had, as

[10:58] he put it, a shit weekend. In my mind, the fact that you were in the mix and maybe unfairly overlooked for 2002, that you didn't just progress and were an automatic pick for 2006 — no, it boggles my mind. Depending on races and times, you know, it went through different phases. I'm just trying to think back — Melbourne was a really flat course at the time. But anyway, to be really honest, it's not something that keeps me awake at night, which — if it was the Olympics, it would 100%

[11:31] keep me awake at night, which is probably worth the discussion we're going to have, right? But before we jump into it — one thing you mentioned, Andy — big shout, Kai Robinson and Rose Davies, we won both 10,000 metre races. The reason I say Kai, he's a local fellow, I still think of him as a kid running down at the spit with us. Do you have some Kai stories? I don't — I wasn't close enough to him to pull out some stories, but the reason is because he obviously moved over to the

[12:02] States pretty quickly and got into college. But I do remember the name floating around as a kid when we used to run at the spit, and then the next thing here he is on the world stage just absolutely killing it. And the thing for people that maybe aren't super close to the Commonwealth Games or track and field stuff — whereas in the pool we are absolutely tearing it up because the Americans aren't

[12:33] there — our big competition isn't there now in the track and the sprints and the shorter events. Yeah, the Americans are missing, well now missing the 10,000 metres, but a lot of those African nations are still there, a lot of those storied African running nations. So these middle distance medals — huge wins. Huge wins for Kai and Rose. Talk about the swimming — can't talk about swimming at these games without talking about Dean Boxall.

[13:03] So here's a stat — where do you think Dean Boxall finishes as a country? So you've got the medal tables. OK, that's a good one. It's interesting, because I was talking to someone from QUT who was like, oh, QUT was the country, we'd be sick — Q University, QUT, sorry. Everyone's making their little comparisons, but OK — one guy, one coach, where does he finish? I assume if Australia's ahead of

[13:35] him, maybe he's fourth behind England and Canada. He's the second best country in the world. No way. The only country that beats him is Australia — Australia himself is ahead of him. Can you believe it? Right, look, it's — again, America not being at these games. The thing everyone's talked about with the Commonwealth Games and the lead-up to it, with what Dan Andrews and the regional Victorian Games and all the rest of it — the thing that undermines these games more than

[14:06] anything is the dominance of Australia. When you're lapping the field. Yeah, but when the Olympic — you've got to compare apples versus apples, right — when the United Kingdom races, but then they don't compete in this. No, exactly, because they divide themselves up. Maybe we should start going as states and territories — maybe we should start going as Queensland and Victoria and NSW. It's not as silly an idea as you

[14:37] think, because I think then at least, for Australia, the interest in the Commonwealth Games — if you wanted to innovate — it's a great idea, Liam, because if you wanted to innovate the Commonwealth Games, that's a brilliant way of doing it, because we're the states and territories. Because sitting now the way it is, it's a dead horse — we are dead in the water. Yeah, we are.

[15:07] And I know it's locked in, I think it's going to India next. But we are thumping them — it's that "in the driveway" type stuff. It's so — you can imagine, from Australia's point of view, doing that and breaking it up like the United Kingdom, it would offer a real — at least for one Commonwealth Games — offer some interest, I think. I love the idea of Cam Myers being there, representing the ACT. I love that, I actually love — I mean, it's a bit of a farce, but I love it. You'd struggle to make it

[15:37] happen, but it would certainly bring some life into it. Like, can we talk about Dean Boxall — shout out, we've been tearing it up in the pool. Flynn Southam dethroning King Cam — sorry, King Kyle — Kaylee McKeown still doing what she's doing, the old man of the pool, amazing, just knows how to get it done. On the track though, what did you make of our sprinters? Did you watch much of it? Let me ask you that. So the question — no, I didn't. OK, I'm going to be — I've watched highlights of different things that have

[16:07] popped up — I think that's how most people will have consumed these Commonwealth Games, via Instagram highlights and Facebook clips and YouTube. I'm going to be honest — I had a discussion, I was actually talking while I was running this morning, and you came up, Liam, because I said we're complete opposites — because you live in news radio, you live in the media world, every morning your job is to consume the traditional media, right, you're getting spammed with emails —

[16:39] I read the paper, I get sent press releases, yep. I live completely in the digital space, that's controlled, to a degree, by algorithms. Yes. So if you're not there and it's not shown to you and you don't watch it, you don't suddenly get shown it — it just disappears, you never see it. So that's been a challenge for me around these Commonwealth Games — until a day before, something came up and I went, holy shit, it's on, I didn't know. And this is just being brutally

[17:09] honest — in half of my conversations, that's exactly the conversation. Often I've been speaking to people and they're like, oh, it's on. And that's a real shame — it's a real shame it's got to that, and a lot of it's got to do with media. Well, I also think — it's a two-handed thing for these games in particular, because I don't think you'll have that problem coming into the LA Olympics, for example, because for

[17:43] those people that have been consuming these games, it is the team of games — they are doing this on, I think, and I'm not 100% sure of the figure, but it's being done at a tenth of the cost of what it was going to cost regional Victoria to host these games. They are doing it on a shoestring — so much so there was — the opening ceremony, I described it on radio as looking more like a high school Eisteddfod than an opening

[18:14] ceremony. Was it in an auditorium? It was in an auditorium, it was proper high school Eisteddfod type stuff. And then there was an issue with one of the lane ropes at the swimming pool on the opening night where it basically broke, and they had some poor bugger there, clearly an employee, not an elite athlete, in the pool with his shirt off trying to fix this thing. And they've had other incidents like that. And then even the way they ran the 100 metre qualifications — I don't know if you saw Rowan Browning's comments. Did see — he said —

[18:44] He was bang on, making it felt like a made-up system, whereby I think in the men's it was like 8 or 9 athletes and probably the women's as well, automatically just were picked, you don't have to run the heat. It was like at high school where they went — it would have been like — it's exactly like what Courtney Atkinson's experience at high school probably was, where they went, nah, Courtney doesn't have to run the heats. Why? Well, because, you know, he's really fast. Except they've done that at the Commonwealth Games — so Locky Kennedy didn't have to run a heat, he was straight through to the semi-finals. Rowan Browning, understandably a

[19:14] little bit miffed, said it feels like they're making this up as it goes along. And because it was also a case of, even if you won your race, you weren't through, because it was done on time — so you could have, and the conditions, the swirling breeze, some of these guys were running with an illegal tailwind, some were running with a slight headwind, and the conditions they ran in weren't taken into account — it was literally the fastest 26 times or whatever got through. Yeah, well, good segue onto Locky, so.

[19:46] Another statement that was made to me was, well, you're now talking about Gout, Gout. I love this — if someone was ribbing me, rightfully so, well, now you might have been thinking of Gout Gout. Yeah, where are you, Gout — and I know I'm doing this for theatrics, right — I know Gout's got a hamstring injury, he's recovering, his team are doing everything right for Gout. If Locky Kennedy had turned

[20:18] up and missed the final, or if he'd been an also-ran in the final, I still think the Australian narrative would have been about Gout — jeez, it was disappointing we didn't have him there, it would have been great to see him there, I wonder what Gout could have done. Now the challenge is on Gout and his team — not that they'll view it like this, but how do we bring the spotlight back here? Because Locky Kennedy is the man right now. A 9.85 in the final in those

[20:50] conditions, a silver medal, and the way he carried himself around everything — the excitement, the enthusiasm, the polish that he spoke with afterwards, the hug with Jayce Richardson as part of the relay. Everything short of winning that gold medal, Locky Kennedy did everything perfectly. Yep. And he's — I'd argue he's probably carried the games in a way, like he's been the face of it. I agree, I agree, that's a great point. He really has brought life to

[21:25] this Commonwealth Games team, because without Kaylee McKeown going as the swimmer, the team felt a little faceless. We didn't have Ariarne there this year — there's no Thorpey, there's no that golden generation of swimmers, Cole Chambers has kind of stepped away from that limelight and celebrity factor, Emma McKeon obviously retiring now, Molly O'Callaghan's not quite there as a personality — so Kaylee McKeown was probably it, and with the injury and the glandular fever she had, she's not there. Who, from traditional media,

[21:56] radio and that, would you put up on the pedestal? Because it always happens, right — you're talking about the Commonwealth Games each morning, or you're reading stuff. Who do you feel like — well, I've been doing radio crosses, even though I'm on holiday from the Gold Coast show at the moment, I've been doing radio crosses three times a week with Central Coast Paddy and Maz on Triple M Central Coast, and the conversation I've had has been about them being Central Coast —

[22:28] Nicola Olyslagers the high jumper is one of their own, so we've been talking a bit about her — she finished second to Eleanor Patterson. Interestingly, Eleanor's based in Italy, Nicola's based here — again, that was probably one where if Nicola had won it would have been a much bigger deal because she's here, and because of the story with her. For me it is Locky Kennedy. The other one — I think Torrie Lewis came into these games red hot, red hot to be the first ever Australian woman to dip

[22:58] under 11 seconds, taking out bronze in the fashion she did. And I made this point as well — her smile — we've talked a bit about the coverage of women's sport recently, but something that's universal in sport, I think, is your smile. And I look at Jess Fox, I look at Daniel Ricciardo — I think Ricciardo is the top of the podium when it comes to sporting smiles. Torrie Lewis, the way she smiles, and the way she smiled after her effort and her races —

[23:31] she's a marketer's dream as an athlete heading into the future, because of the way she races, her elite ability, and you put that smile on top and you've got a beautiful little cherry on the package there. So yeah, Torrie and Locky Kennedy — I also think the one to watch — it's hard, because as we're talking about this, I believe the final will have happened, we haven't seen it yet — Cam Myers, this famous mile race going up against Kurt, who recently broke the mile world

[24:01] record. Cam was fantastic in his heat — depending on how he's gone in that final, do you think that might shape things as well? It could really announce another big name in Australian track and field. But the other person who's shone throughout all this — you know what — it's Bruce. Yes, Bruce is still the best storyteller we have on Australian sports media. He's still the best — he stepped away from footy, he still loves his horse racing,

[24:31] but having Bruce there as the feature commentator for these games — it's going to be hard when he finally stops, because what he brings to track and field, to running, to athletics in this country, is something that's not easily, if even possibly, replaced. It's been good to see Richo out there too. Richo's awesome, I love the way Richo talks about sport. In fact — I thought Chevo and Emma — yeah, I know I don't want to talk about mainstream media coverage, but I

[25:03] genuinely think Chevo and Emma, the enthusiasm they've spoken with about all the athletes, and Dave Culbert's commentary — they've all done a great job, and Tamsyn's brilliant. Great team. OK, let's move on — let's not blow smoke up that team too much. No, you started to sound like a commentator, Liam. Sorry, you went into full commentator mode. I've got to reel you back in. Let's go left here — the debate of the fittest on earth.

[25:36] So this week — big shout out to Jay Crouch, the Aussie who got third at the CrossFit Games. Never heard of the bloke, I'm just being honest. Look what we are here — Jay Crouch, OK. But the reason I want to bring it up is CrossFit — every time they have the CrossFit Games, they claim the fittest person, both male and female, is the fittest person on earth. It's a

[26:06] bit like when the NBA champs claim themselves as world champions. I agree. Yes, so — all congratulations to Jay, that is amazing, I'm just looking up Jay here — he's a beast. Congratulations to Jay. However, let's go around this claim that the winner is the fittest person on earth, because there's a big claim in the same week of the Tour de France finish. Very different fitness. Where do you sit on this, Liam? You've got arguably not only once in a generation

[26:36] but once a century, the fittest person, publicly finishing — obliterating, definitely a tainted record from 1995 up L'Alpe d'Huez, finally been cracked, not just for seconds, one minute fourteen. He beat Pantani's record.

[27:06] And then you've got, in the same week, CrossFit saying the fittest people on earth, OK. It's impossible to compare sports really — like comparing eras, you just can't. But I remember reading some stories comparing sports from an athleticism and fitness perspective, and boxing was one that came out right near the top — but again, is that heavyweight boxing, is that flyweight boxing? The way I would look at it is

[27:40] how much are you dominating your peers, in your field? Yeah, but no, that's not the fittest — you're going down the road of who's the best athlete, and that's you making a comparison on how far you distance yourself from your peers, who's the GOAT, who's the best. It's the wording of "who is the fittest" — so it's probably working out what fitness is to you. What's fitness, is it —

[28:13] is it about being able to do multiple things, lift, run, whatever it is, or is fitness just purely who has the biggest engine? When I think about it, I dwell on it — because when I think about fitness, I'm not comparing ultra runners to Tour de France riders or to 1500 metre runners, but the fittest person on earth is

[28:43] about endurance and it's about suffering — because that's what we're made to do, right. Well in that case I'd argue Ross Edgley's probably the fittest bloke on the planet. Please. Is he not? Hang on, so you're comparing Ross Edgley to the Tour de France winner? Yeah. How does Pogačar

[29:15] swim around the UK, Liam? Please. Can Pogačar swim around the UK like Ross Edgley? And again — I saw you swimming out in the ocean in your wetsuit — if I gave you five years and enough mental strength, you could swim around the UK. Yeah, but you've got to give me enough mental strength. But that's not the fittest person on earth, that's just survival around an island. And I'm not

[29:45] downplaying the feat, I'm just saying — in your own little world. No, I'm not downplaying it — I don't want to swim around the UK, but I'm talking about the fittest person on earth, the true pinnacle of what our species is, the trainability and the pinnacle of performance. I don't know if Pogačar's ability to ride up a mountain fast is the pinnacle of our species.

[30:15] We're back to disagreeing heavily here, Liam. The two-hour marathon breaking, the fittest on earth, the pinnacle of fitness, versus just going out and doing something. So with that in mind, it can't be Pogačar, because he's on a bike. I'm happy to be challenged — he's on a bike, so immediately it's like Formula One.

[30:47] Immediately there's an engineering element to it, a technical aspect to his achievements — there's IP around him and his bike, isn't there, there's intellectual property that his team have about the mechanical element of his sport, that bike. It's not all about the body — Lance Armstrong, it's not all about the bike, or whatever his book was — there is a mechanical element to this, right? It's a mechanical element, but I'd actually argue it's still the body driving that — we'll

[31:19] put him on the same bike as everyone else, then I'll be more impressed. Kilian Jornet, yes, I'll put him in the conversation then — people that don't know Kilian Jornet, greatest trail runner, mountain runner we've probably ever seen — that's someone where there's no technical stuff, that's pure him building an engine over the years. He grew up in these mountains, his mum and dad raised him — he's an elite-level

[31:51] cross-country skier as well, I believe. Ski mountaineering, all that sort of stuff. Now you're talking about the peak of our species, now you're talking about the pinnacle. So you want to see some multi-discipline element of being able to do more than the speciality to be the fittest, because then that's actually going down the CrossFit road, right? So you're leaning towards — I look at what Jay Crouch, my new best mate Jay Crouch, does — I've just learned about CrossFit, and it's truly impressive.

[32:23] Let's talk about Tia-Clare Toomey — am I saying her name right? I might be getting it wrong, apologies — she's an explosive athlete with her weightlifting, but then she's an aerobic beast as well with her running and repeats and all that sort of stuff. And we're getting into HYROX territory as well. I think those non-technical strength tests are a part of being fit.

[32:57] Now, I don't reckon Pogačar could help me carry my groceries out of the car, frankly. I reckon he's a one-trick pony. Jeez, I'm being pretty disrespectful, I don't mean that, this is just me thinking out loud. I'm going to go with Kilian Jornet — that's my answer to who's the — you're sticking with your Milo heritage. The great debate here is there's no right answer, and I agree with you — it's

[33:31] not an objective argument. Exactly — but it's also how you personally define fitness. Because if it's multidisciplined, 100%, CrossFit is making a claim and a statement, and they can argue that. I mean, Harry Styles is in the conversation — sub-three-hour marathon plus, it must be exhausting doing all those shows and all those songs back to back. I can't wait for the comments to come in this week, Liam. It's an unanswerable question, because fitness is so

[34:06] specific about how you define it — Alex Honnold should be in the conversation too, the endurance required to climb that building, the strength required, his grip strength. Is he not in it — soloing El Cap? I'm not in disagreement at all that every sport has their thing. When

[34:37] someone says to me "fittest," I automatically go to the furthest, the quickest — but it's not about who can go the longest. Well, who's the fitter athlete then — Sebastian Coe or Noah Lyles? Whoa, Sebastian, shots fired. This is fun, it's a fun conversation. I'd even go as far as, if you wanted to put it into a structure —

[35:11] the old VO2 max could probably play a part in it. Well, then it's your mate — what's his name, Kristian Blummenfelt? All right, debate settled, congratulations. If you want to put a number on it, you might go down that road — congratulations, Kristian Blummenfelt. Let us know what you think, because that's a real one. Keeping it on Kristian and the triathlon route —

[35:41] we were talking about it a while back — Ironman and GoPro cameras, T100, which is PTO's version of it, and World Triathlon's version have announced a partnership. They've gone the other way and announced a partnership with Oakley Meta. Obviously they have the cameras running, more so smart glasses. I can't believe more sporting organisations aren't doing this. I can't believe HYROX isn't doing this. They may, but I don't believe they are. Why wouldn't you? I believe I went on a couple of episodes back about how more access isn't

[36:13] necessarily better, but any opportunity to give you a view from the POV of the athlete in a sport is worthwhile having. I mean, I don't think they're at the stage where they can go live from these races, however, the fact you can go after the race and cut up clips about that pass, or literally put it in the run of the shoes — this is amazing. I think it's great, it's smart. Moving on to Ultra where we

[36:47] both want to end up one day — I'm pretty sure UTMB — yes, maybe not so fast, because the new mayor — say it, you asked me to say the name, say the town — Chamonix, oh, you can say that one — can you now say the mayor's name, it's down there in the caption, say it — Javier Lafin — yeah, good, you missed his first name though, François — François having

[37:19] — the new mayor of the town has decided residents feel pushed out, and he wants to reduce the footprint of future editions. Might mean we're more unlikely to get over there. Well, what do you reckon? It's interesting, because compared with where we live here on the Gold Coast, our mayor is come one, come all, bring everything, make it bigger, grow, grow, grow, grow. That's Tom Tate's attitude towards this town.

[37:49] Yeah, but this is a town on the grow, with room, exactly, and population growth. This is a small town, Chamonix, for those that haven't been — bottom of a valley. How would you — yeah, bottom of a valley, small town effectively, you can't really build too far up the sides of the cliffs, but it's like a traditional old town. During snow season, it's the playground of the rich and famous, but outside of snow season, in their summer, it does get overtaken with trail runners

[38:23] during the UTMB event. I appreciate the attempt to make a smaller footprint, but I would be avoiding any attempts to make the event smaller — it'd be like the MCG coming out and saying we're going to reduce seating for the grand final. This is the trail race in the world, it is the event, and it's kind of like not appreciating what you've got

[38:55] till it's gone. If you tried to suddenly make this slightly smaller — who's to say somewhere else in that vicinity would go, well, we'll take it. But just playing devil's advocate, the town probably does all right out of tourism anyway, and residents are probably thinking, well, it only comes around once a year. I'll tell you what, Courtney, I'll come over next year for the race and we'll investigate.

[39:26] Just on that though — I've never heard that from you, wanting to race UTMB, is that on the bucket list? To be honest, I've probably never said it before, I've just seen it — but it's something I'd probably like to experience, see it. Because I've never got there — I got to Zegama, which is the other one I wanted to get to. I think, like yourself, there's a few crew going over this year and I'm kind of like,

[39:57] I think you'd like to travel and go see it — yeah, if you're going to do something, it would interest me more than a few of the other events going around. Good to know, we'll store that one away, maybe down the road. Travels ahead — and I love this, I can't believe we haven't come up with this — the ultimate run club. You've apparently been in the thick of it — the running of the bulls. This is the ultimate run club.

[40:28] I've done it. I did it, it was in 2010. I went over to Pamplona, I was doing the two-year-over season, I'll admit it, I ran it in the wussiest way possible — like crawling up the walls. Yep, 100% — preservation over celebration. For me, it was thrilling, it was exciting, I didn't actually make it into the arena, I was basically — why is that? Just too many people by that stage — no real

[41:00] desire. It was interesting because I wasn't married, didn't have kids, but I still valued my physical wellbeing — I must have been 27, and I'd obviously hit the point where I was like, I don't want to get hurt really badly doing this. So no, I ran down the street for a little bit with the big crew, and then when the bulls came, I literally scrambled, jumped up and held onto something on the walls as they came past. What I'd like to see is all the new run clubs with flags — flag bearers, flag

[41:33] bearers — no, see, get out. That's where I think this relates nicely to the mayor of Chamonix and wanting a smaller footprint — do not disrespect the running of the bulls. You do not disrespect the running of the bulls. I saw many a foreigner be, how shall I say, educated by the locals in Pamplona. That's good to hear — about how to treat these bulls, because yes, they run them and then they end up killing them in these arenas as part of

[42:05] the bullfights. But if you disrespect the bulls during that arena section, you find out really quick there's a bit of local justice that happens. So I think if any run club showed up with a flag and tried to make this historic event about them, you'd get educated very quickly on local respect. So if you're a run club out there thinking about doing a little adventure around Europe — there's an off-the-cuff idea, Liam —

[42:38] run club tours, right — if you know people, the boys from Inspired Unemployed have a travel company now, I think it's called Rival — team up with a run club and launch a Kontiki-style running tour that goes around different cities of Europe. Kontiki did that? Do they do run tours? Yeah, right, I didn't know that. There you go, OK, so it's not a new idea, but if it's specifically designed around

[43:08] running — young crew, effectively, if you're a run club with the right demographic, make a tour, build a tour, that's a cracking idea. But don't try and make these historic events about you — you're there to enjoy, to appreciate. If you try and make it about you, that's when you get yourself in trouble. Now, can we pivot slightly, because this actually ties into something I wanted to bring up with you today. Sure, I don't know if you had a chance to grab the audio for me, the

[43:39] Bali Run Club story. No, I didn't, that's OK, I'm going to bring it up for you — I'm going to play a bit of audio out of my phone, because we know that us Australians love a bit of adventure to Bali, don't we, Courtney, love to go and build our new lives over there. Well, maybe you more than me. I'm going to play you a bit of audio here — this is a story from the ABC about a run club in Bali. "A run club in Bali has been accused of discriminating against locals and violating regulations.

[44:11] The organisers have now been banned from Indonesia. It all started when complaints went viral online — Indonesians said their applications to join Entourage Bali via WhatsApp were ghosted, meanwhile foreigners had their applications approved almost immediately." So basically there's this mob in Bali called Entourage Bali, and it was set up for — I think the phrase they used was "digital nomads." So it's for the influencers and

[44:42] all these people that go over there, and they wanted to curate their run club, right, but it's been effectively shut down — the Indonesian government has come in and gone, you can't come in here and create a world that shuts us out of our own country. And it's interesting, because these people, apparently the two Dutch blokes who started it, have left the country and been banned. But I noticed —

[45:12] this was an interesting message the run club sent back, saying: "First and foremost we are extremely sorry for the people that have been offended and hurt, and we never meant to be disrespectful or discriminating to anyone. Entourage was created as a community for digital nomads in Bali, to help people who are new to the island connect with others and do fun activities together during their stay." I hate the term "digital nomads," it makes me feel ill saying it.

[45:45] "Being a digital nomad is not defined by nationality — our community includes members from many countries, including Indonesia. Some of our events have always been open and free for everyone to attend, while others have had participation requirements based on the purpose of the event. For example, certain events were designed specifically for digital nomads, while others, such as women's walks and workshops, were intended exclusively for female participants." This is them covering their backsides, blah blah blah. And then when they acknowledged the fact that Indonesians were being excluded, they said: "We

[46:15] have made errors in the automated approval process for our WhatsApp groups and non-running events. We were trying to create a place where digital nomads could meet. A bias was created where some, not all, of local numbers for Indonesians were incorrectly rejected. We are pausing all our events and activities for now. We take full accountability for what has happened and promise we will make real changes going forward." This to me — I love it, this encapsulates a lot about what running is right now, and going back to the running of the

[46:48] bulls thing — you've got to be respectful of the broader environment. To extrapolate a simple thing like running the hedges down here on the Goldie — be respectful of the locals, you don't get to take over that street, you have fun, build your club, but be respectful of your environment. This mob in Bali wanted to create a thing, that's fine, but you still have to be respectful of where you are, and the Indonesian government doesn't play around — you only have to ask old mate Schapelle.

[47:18] They don't play around, you've got to be respectful of where you are, and if you're going to build something great, be respectful of your environment is what I would say. I don't really have too much to say on it, except I can't believe this is actually news — the fact this has become news, the great thing about running is there's so many different people from so many different walks of life doing it. The fact that, whether

[47:48] this is right or wrong — it's probably a bit wrong — but the fact is, it's news, and we're talking about it, let's move on. No, let's move on — I've got one for you which is a bit more exciting, I think, because I like this one. Have you heard of rogaining? The hair stuff? No, no — it's what, Rogaine, isn't it? I think you're right, but it's also the athletic stuff. So John Ingram sent this in, this is a

[48:18] great call — you were talking about your capture-the-flag ideas, a bit of a novelty, I'm still working on it, some people think there's something in it, some sit on the side of novelty, and Jono is one of them. Look, I'm certainly not sold on Liam's idea so far. All right, but have you heard of rogaining? It's similar to orienteering, but you don't have a course to follow — you get a map only hours before the event, with checkpoints you can hit, each worth varying

[48:49] points based on how difficult they are to get to and how far off-trail they are. You have a set time to finish, and you get as many points as possible by running out to set points. Some events are 12 hours, others are 24. He's not a rogainer, he's a trail runner — but why not go and do a rogaine? I think we should, that sounds interesting. I believe there is a rogaine, and this might be our first way of getting everyone

[49:22] involved. I actually believe — I'm not taking you on in any sort of race, no, no, no, no. It's a team event — place by the back of your hand — a team event. Oh, then I'm in. Exactly, yeah — no, no, so this is where we're taking your flag idea of being a team, but taking the novelty element out of it. We'll leave that to the run clubs, yes, let's go proper, core, traditional. This is a format based off orienteering with an Australian regulator.

[49:54] It's like a proper event, we can go and compete in — an endurance event you've actually got to think about, love it, that's good. It's not just fitness, it's strategy — off track, trail, all the things we love. But they need a new name, great call John, they need a new name, just because Rogaine is also what people like me who are losing their hair try and use to keep it on top of their head — the rogaining calendar, Australia. So have you ever seen an

[50:25] adventure race with the little orange and white kites? Yes, and you go along and you've got your little — dude, I used to do that. Are you talking to an old-school orienteerer? OK, and — I didn't realise this — I used to orienteer with mum and dad in Belair National Park in SA, and

[50:56] — in racing, or just going to find out — just a family fun day thing, I think I raced in it once. But also, for those people who might remember — I mean, you were probably in the elite pathway, so they didn't bother putting you through it — but they'd have the people who'd come to your school and do all those tests, like a broad jump and an arm-span test, and then they'd say the sports you were suited for. You were going to be in orienteering — orienteering was my number one sport. What, is it like — do you have to duck under branches? I must have told the bloke where the toilet was and given him really good directions or something. I don't know — I think we should work this out, let's go, you've found something.

[51:26] No, I've recalled someone telling me this and I don't know whether they're still there, but Nerang Forest — I believe my mate Gary may have actually had a hand in setting this up — Nerang Forest actually have permanent rogaining courses in there right now. Oh, that's really exciting. Let's pick this up, we're going to follow this on — yeah, we're going to be rogainers, one of us already might be. So, OK, we've found this — this might be where we take the capture

[51:56] the flag idea into the real world. Quickly — you put something in the run sheet for today about the president of Czechia, and about his hobby and what he does — it was an interesting one, yeah. President by day, F1 photographer by — are you going to say his name? I'm not — where am I, in Russia, what did they say his name is?

[52:27] I haven't got it up — I've got it up. It doesn't actually say what his name is, but the president of the Czech Republic has one of the coolest hobbies you'll ever see. "In his free time, Petr Pavel heads to Formula One and other motorsport events as an officially accredited photographer, capturing the action simply because he loves it" — the Dakar Rally, and apparently one of the comments below says that he sells his photos and all the money goes to a children's single-mothers charity. This guy looks gangster, doesn't he look like a legend? He looks like — you know what he looks like?

[52:59] He looks like he'd have a good military background. Yeah, well, actually — no, no, no, that's a good — I think, off the back of that, I started digging, I'm like, I wonder what other world leaders have been runners, what world leaders have had running as their hobby. Obviously this bloke loves motorsports. And I found a couple — well, Howard was a walker. That's not the same class at all. No — Johnny Howard, God bless

[53:31] him, in his tracksuit and his giant civil-style action, but he was not a runner. So the current Prime Minister of the UK, Andy Burnham — and I don't know, you tell me whether there's a conspiracy here — he ran the Great Manchester 10K recently and he basically finished bang on the average completion time for British males, 53 minutes and 15 seconds. Do you reckon he's done that on purpose? Are you calling for a

[54:03] fact check? No, he's a 56-year-old runner, he runs. So the current British PM runs a 53:10 10K. Is that the PM from this week or last week? This week, current. Next week, who knows. Current as of time of recording. We had our own — Tony Abbott has done a sub-80-minute City2Surf. Yeah, and triathlons — yeah, I actually met Tony

[54:33] at a few tries — have you? Yeah, over the years, loves his budgies, does love budgies. But this is the one I did not know about this man — do you know who's a big runner? George W. Bush. He's an avid runner, he's got a calmness about it. This was very funny — I found an interview he did with Runner's World back in —

[55:06] when did he do it, years ago, obviously when he was in charge — but interestingly, he talks about the importance of running, and he finds time to run every day. He says he usually runs six days a week — when he doesn't run, he uses an elliptical trainer, does all this other stuff. But when he runs, he runs hard — on Sundays, if he's at Camp David, he'll go for a hard morning run, which at the time was he'd do 3 miles, usually in about 20 minutes and 45 seconds, on a tough course. And then he'd go for a walk with

[55:37] his wife. He tries to go for longer runs, but it's difficult to do around the White House. But he ran a marathon in 1993 — I want you to try and predict what time George W. Bush ran in that 1993 marathon. So which is — 33 years ago, I guess it would have been in the — this is George W, no, so 33 years ago, he's 47 when he ran it. I'm going to say 4 hours 12. He ran a 3:44.

[56:10] He ran a 3:44 marathon. Pretty solid — as the president, or prior? I don't believe he was president at the time, that would have been too long ago. But yeah, big running guy. There you go — didn't know about it. I think he was just before he became governor of Texas. But interestingly, one other thing he wrote is that during the war, when he was in the middle of all his war stuff, his runs were faster. He said — and he knew he probably shouldn't be laughing about it — but he said it's interesting that my times became faster right after the war began.

[56:41] They were pretty fast all along, but since the war began, I've been running with a little more intensity. So there you go. And he went on to say that if I can find time as the president of the United States to run, everyone can find time to run. Where are we at, how are we doing for time today? We've got some time, we're going to keep rolling, let's keep going, we've got plenty to get through. I'm going to go next — Kate Jones sent this in, have a listen to this. The secret to making sure you have a

[57:11] bathroom on race day: come the night before and put a padlock — only you know the combination — on the porta-potty, and the next day you have your own toilet. That wasn't so clear, but literally, padlock a porta-loo the night before a marathon so you can come back and have a nice toilet. This came up on my algorithm as well, Kate — it didn't get good feedback. If I saw someone do this, I'd be tipping it

[57:42] over while they're in it. Strong chance someone's going to put their own lock on it once they're in there. Oh, that's funny — and then you're stuck in there. I'm not sure if I told you about my radio idea — this is where our two worlds collide. I had an idea and for whatever reason it didn't get off the ground. I wanted to give away the golden porta-loo — I wanted my radio station, Triple M Gold, to build a

[58:13] golden porta-loo. As in, it's just a porta-loo but painted gold — make it all nice inside, give it a fluffy seat cover, all the rest of it. You can have it for the day. So if you're going to a music festival, or a marathon, or an event where inevitably there are going to be lines, the golden porta-loo — we will deliver it there, and only you have the key. Great idea. Here's another question — premium porta-loos at a marathon,

[58:44] you've got to have a wristband to get into that porta-loo. How much would you pay to be guaranteed a toilet within, let's say, 3 minutes, no line-up? Max, 50 bucks. I'm going to go higher. How much? I'd pay $50 — if it's on top of my entry fee into the race, for an extra $50 guaranteed

[59:17] 3-minute turnaround for a toilet. I'm not planning on running events this size, so I'm going to put it out there and someone can take the idea — but just like, say, Gold Coast Marathon's a good example, because they have the elite area, and in that elite area there's a few porta-loos, you've got your personal bag drop and everything else. The easiest way for an event to upscale and make a bit of extra coin on the side is to offer a paid premium lounge area. Smart — it becomes like the music festivals with the —

[59:47] let's not call it VIP, but a premium area you can pay extra for — it's an apple lounge, nothing — you don't get an extra line-up on the spot or anything you've got to qualify for. No, I'm not in for giving performance, no, this is purely just capitalism — I want to pay $5,000 just so I can rock up and — $5,000? I wouldn't, but I believe you could charge $5,000. Shut up.

[1:00:19] No, no, you could not, that is insane. Do you know why I believe you could do this? Why? Because when there's a charity spot to get into an event you can't get into, how much will people pay? Yeah, but — no, no, to get into the Ironman, or if you want to — there's charity spots. What was I looking at entering the other day, it was like charity spots open the day before the event, how much, like $3,000, and you get in. Yeah, but it's very different

[1:00:50] to saying I'm going to pay this extra money because it's for charity and I get to do the event, versus I just don't want to line up for a toilet. How many of those people paying for the charity entry are really paying for the charity, and how many just don't want to miss the event? I agree, it's a great cause, it's going to — yeah, but I truly believe the majority of them paying for that aren't considering the charity or not, they're just going, I don't want to miss the event. I agree with that. I don't want to have to line up

[1:01:21] and go to a shitty toilet, I'm just going to pay for it. I truly believe there's a market there — for a 40,000-person event, I reckon you could sell 100 to 200 at 3 grand. That's that — that might be the most insane thing I've ever heard you say on this podcast, that you think you could sell toilet access for $3,000. No, no, not just toilet access — a premium experience where when you

[1:01:52] rock up next to the start, like the elite — they have that at Noosa, don't they, Noosa Triathlon has a VIP area and then you get access to the bar section on the finish line. Well, you get to go for free because you won the thing — most people have to pay to get in there, Courtney. No, but this is the VIP packages — yeah, at Noosa, the Garmin Beach Club. What do you get for that? But that's not for the pre-event, is it, or is it before, pre-swim? So you get early swim start, the VIP, Garmin Beach Club entry

[1:02:23] at Noosa, priority entry, early swim start, priority check-in and bike racking, premium bike racking, VIP beach club access on the Saturday and the Sunday, concierge service Thursday through Sunday, a welcome gift, free festival entry, and a guest invited into the VIP marquee. How much? OK, so this is a good question — how much is an entry into the standard Noosa? I'm going to guess about 500 bucks. I think it's a bit more now. For that VIP, it's $1,000, so you're doubling the price. 500

[1:02:55] bucks, you said 3,000 — I believe at the Gold Coast Marathon you could charge $3,000, I believe at Sydney Marathon you could charge $3,000. I call it the Courtney Atkinson package. All right, very good. Hey, speaking of marathons quickly, I wanted to give a shout out to the Nike Melbourne Marathon, because you and I have been talking a lot about the Melbourne Marathon and how it's a really big year for this race, right — Gold Coast has done what it's done, it's now the fastest Australian marathon,

[1:03:25] we've got the Sydney major marathon on the way. Melbourne — I don't want to say it's in danger, I think it's got a great opportunity, and I really like everything they've done in the lead-up to it. And we talked about the fact that with Nike on board as the partner, you've got the biggest brand in the room there to help your marathon succeed. Now, I love this from Tanya — Tanya commented saying Melbourne could be billed as

[1:03:55] Australia's sporting marathon — you run past the side of the Australian Open, you run past the Australian Grand Prix track, and then you run around the finish at the MCG. It's a good call, it's a really nice package, a nice blend I think to add alongside Gold Coast, Melbourne — sorry, the Nike Melbourne Marathon. Nice idea Tanya, love the creativity, love the suggestion, it's a good one. Talking about it — Nike, at the moment I got back in the bush wearing the Nike ACG gear.

[1:04:27] I love this top, I wear this — this is one of those ACG, all-conditions-gear pieces they sent us. I love this jacket, I just wear it around, it's my walkabout jacket. It's good gear. What was I going to say — shoes. Talking about ACG, yeah, so I had a range of shoes I was trialling in the bush — I got back in the bush, did some hill repeats, and threw a few different shoes on. I keep coming back to

[1:05:00] that ACG Zoom Gama. I love it, I'm still putting it up there with one of my favourite shoes of all time, hands down. So what I did — I went and tested it against, I had a few other brands sitting in the garage that I had to try, and I'm going to go and do my long runs in the Gama. That's it, you just found it.

[1:05:30] I found my shoe, right, at this stage — that's it, simple as that. You know what I did do — there's a hill for those who run in the Nerang area, I think it's called Explorer, someone told me the other day — but it was a hill in the middle of things, I got out to Nerang and thought, what can I do, I don't really want to go running long, I don't want to do anything, so I decided I'm just going to do hill repeats. So it's a 10-minute hill straight up. And the thing I noticed — because I'm about three weeks post-marathon now — the first rep I'm

[1:06:03] just cruising up, keeping my heart rate below 150, nice and easy. And then what I learned after the next two reps is that the marathon's still not out of my legs. And it wasn't so much in the legs — I was getting a bit tired, but my heart rate was doing funny things still, I'm not fully — so I think I jumped the gun a little on Tuesday, is what I'm saying. I reckon it needs to just run its course for a while, not quite there yet. That's a good one for anybody

[1:06:35] that's listening who might have run a marathon recently — three weeks in and I was like, I'm ready, and even Courtney Atkinson's not back there yet, so if you feel like you should be back running and you're not, that's OK. Talk a bit about my running — yes, I ran, I tried to run a mono the other day, and I'm back actually training. I've seen you running, but I'm more interested in one, where was my invite, and two, what were you doing in the

[1:07:07] water? Yeah, I saw you out with the group — I jumped in your group, yes I did. I thought I might have seen you down there — actually, if I'd known you were going, I would have made an effort. I made my saltwater swimmers debut with Ty Dalka and the crew this week just gone. I've signed up for the swim-run event that's coming to the Gold Coast — I'm doing the 12K race, which I think has 1.7K worth of swimming in it and 10K of running.

[1:07:37] Oh, this is the swim-run — yeah, and then I've got Noosa in November. Not a strong swimmer, swimming ain't my thing, swimming in open water is even less my thing — for me it's all mental, I panic, I get nervous, it's not a comfortable environment for me to be in, and the only way to overcome that is exposure therapy, to be out there in it. So I messaged Ty and said, mate,

[1:08:08] I'm on holidays for a couple of weeks, I've got to get down — he said come and do some one-on-one stuff with me in the creek if you want, otherwise here are some dates. I said great, I'll come next Wednesday. Now, this is how uncomfortable I am with open water swimming — going to bed that night I'm thinking, should I message Ty now and say there's something with the kids I can't get to — I was already looking for excuses. Then my alarm went off in the morning, I'm still thinking what could my excuse be to not go. Anyway, I get up, I drag myself down to the beach,

[1:08:40] I've got my wetsuit, I've got everything, and I walk out and I can't see him, I couldn't see anyone — I thought there would have been more people up at the surf club. Well, I checked the message and they were starting from Burleigh, and I kind of went, oh well, I'm not going to make it — I got in the car, drove around there, and they were literally heading down to the water's edge as I got there. And I went out, and it's really uncomfortable for me — it's tough for me to be open water swimming like that, I get nervous, honestly,

[1:09:11] plainly, the simple fact of it is I worry about drowning, I genuinely worry about drowning. And I know, because we had a moment — Ty is amazing, and it was the best, perfect conditions for a wuss like me, because it was so calm and peaceful and the water clarity was good, it was beautiful. But Ty was brilliant, he's there on the board, and I know I'm not going to drown, I do know I'm not going to drown, but I still think about it, that's just how my brain works when I'm swimming. And then we have a moment out

[1:09:41] there when everybody's out doing big targets, everybody kind of starfishing, floating on the back — it was an incredible feeling, an amazing experience. I'm going to make you feel even better about your anxiety — conditions have been magic. Yeah, they have, like all-time magic. So on Sunday, I was out, probably not too far from where you're swimming,

[1:10:13] on the boat, and we'd gone out purposely whale watching, so we'd been seeing these whales pop up, like 500 metres away, 400 metres away, whatever, and then probably you'd be out, I don't know, like a K and a half off the beach out from Burleigh there, so not too far down from where you're swimming. We stopped, I end up stopping for lunch and just drifting, sitting at the back of the boat having lunch. Next thing, a whale — I kid you not, like the size of a Tarago — just popped up, right there,

[1:10:47] I could have reached over and given it a tap on the head. It's the scariest scenario I've had in my life, my heart rate just spiked thinking about that, because in my head I went, what if I was in the ocean and a whale was nearby. Well, that's why I'm telling you the story, Liam, thanks, great. So this whale ended up just — we had no motor running — popped back up under the boat, and I was like — but then it made me think, because I'm the same, when I go down to Burleigh, we swim along

[1:11:17] there and I'm like, there's some big things out here. Whales — don't tell me that. Anyway, swimming next week was great, Ty was amazing, he told me I was patting the cat too much on the way out, meaning I was just flapping my hand into the water, he's giving me some technical stuff to work on. I do want to do more of it, because the thing I was thinking as I was out there is when my daughter Quinn is out doing nippers and I see her, she's tentative into the waves and into the ocean compared with some of the other kids, and I'm always there going, come on mate, you'll be OK, and don't stand around and look at the waves as they come,

[1:11:48] just swim, it'll bring you forward. It's all do as I say, not as I do, I can't do those things myself, so I need to get out there and improve on this sort of stuff. So big shout to Ty for holding my hand out there, I loved it and I want to do more of it. Carla Gilbert was out there — I mean, just from a sports nerd's perspective, having legend Carla Gilbert out there in the ocean alongside on the water safety. Yeah, well, she was looking after the crew for the most part, and then young Fletcher, who — while Ty went off and looked after some of the rest of the crew, young Fletch,

[1:12:20] lad from Varsity Lakes High School, just there telling me I'm doing a good job. By making sure you didn't go under. Making sure I didn't go under, so thank you to the whole crew, but it was brilliant, it was so much fun. Yeah, magic time of year, isn't it, when the water temp's perfect and you're out there and the sun's coming up. But even for running, I mean it's so much easier running when the temperatures are being like they are, it's beautiful. Are we — is it time for my announcement, Courtney? For everyone. Who? Everyone. If you've been waiting all this time, if you've been waiting

[1:12:50] just for this, or if you fast-forward just to this, here it is. I want to thank the In The Beginning family, because I don't think this happens without them. Next Sunday morning I will be hosting the broadcast of the City to Surf in Sydney. It's official on the mic. Oh, and not like I did at the Gold Coast Marathon, this is on the TV, right, and this comes up where — can we tune in? I think it's going to be on 9Now and YouTube.

[1:13:23] But I am, along with Tammy Barker, your old mate, and thank you to Ironman Australia and Craig Hayden, the crew, for giving me the chance. But the reason I wanted to tell everyone about it here is because I think this opportunity has, in large part, come from the support and celebration of the In The Beginning crew on the start-finish line of the Gold Coast Marathon. That's huge, Courtney, because Craig — this is that, they wanted, they said, we want that similar energy on the broadcast for the City to

[1:13:54] Surf. On the TV you can't tackle people. On TV, I'm not allowed to tackle people and shake and cuddle and all the rest of it, but yeah, I'm going, I'm really excited, this is the world's biggest fun run. That is, this is the world — congratulations. Thank you, so, and yeah, I mean it, part of the beginning family — the run, the running, the running fun continues. So if anybody out there who listens is running the City to Surf next weekend, slide into my messages and I'll give you a shout out on the TV. And we'll be watching, we'll have to let everyone

[1:14:24] know where it's on. Yeah, alright team, enjoy the week, we'll be back next week. See you next week, bye.